EPISODE 062: Why my BFF didn't do EC
Welcome to the Go Diaper Free Podcast, where we're all about helping you stop depending on diapers as early as birth. I'm your host, Andrea Olson, author and mom of five EC'd babies. This is episode 62, Why my BFF didn't do EC.
Welcome to the show, you guys. So glad to have you back. Please take a moment and leave a review of this podcast so more people can find out about elimination communication on iTunes. If you can take a moment to do that today, I would be very grateful and so will all those babies, because most moms say, "I would have done EC if I would've known about it earlier," and so do the dads.
Okay. This episode today, seriously, I really tried to get my best friend Kelly to do EC, but in the end, today I'm going to share with you why she admits to never having done it, why she chose not to do EC. My very best friend. It's kind of heartbreaking, but also very eye opening. I think that we can come away from this story at the end here today with some resources and some ideas about how to help mamas who are raising babies by themselves these days.
Okay, so Kelly, she was around in California when I wrote my book, the first version of my book, Go Diaper Free, and she saw me ECing my first baby, Kaiva, about nine years ago, because he's nine now. She, day in and day out, saw me taking him to the potty and how well he was going with all that. She even saw me taking him out of diapers at nine and a half months, and she was very impressed. She definitely was like, "Hey, if I ever have a baby, I'm totally going to do this and you need to show me how." I agreed to, and when that time came when she was pregnant, just a few years ago, I sent her my book and a top hat potty. I encouraged her and gave her a little preview about it and told her to call me anytime, I can walk her through it.
She was living in Hawaii and I was still here in Asheville. She ended up having a cesarean birth. It was very traumatic. She had a long recovery period. She had a really hard time. So far away in Hawaii, from Asheville, I called and I asked her if she was going to be able to start EC even though she had a C-section. She said, "Oh, I haven't even read your book yet," and I felt really, really sad. It turns out Kelly was really having a hard time during her pregnancy because the father of the baby didn't want to be involved in his life, so she had no support and was hustling to try to make some dough before she had that baby. So she didn't get to read it. I said, "All right, that's cool," and I was very patient. She said, "I'm going to read it," and I said, "Okay."
I didn't bother her about it. Few more months, nothing. Then, she stopped talking to me for quite a long time. I don't think it was personal, I think she was totally overwhelmed with being a new mom, but I felt like some of it was that she was ashamed that every time I checked in with her about everything baby and then I learned that she hadn't even tried to do EC, I honestly think she felt kind of bad. I don't want her to feel that way and we talked about it later, but during that time it was pretty rough.
She recently moved back to the contiguous United States, to Utah with her parents, and we caught up on the phone. I asked her, "Why didn't you do EC?" But before we get to that, her son who is freaking adorable, Phoenix, he was almost three and they were trying to get him into the nice Waldorf preschool. They asked if he was potty trained, because they only let in three year olds because you have to be potty trained to be in their particular school. They answered, "Well, kind of. Actually, not really all the time. No, he still wears Pull-Ups a lot." So they didn't really let him in yet and they finally decided to get into gear and try to train this kid already. He actually can't go to that school until he is.
So she said that she's working on it. She's trying potty training now, but she also, Kelly told me that her dad keeps putting her child in Pull-Ups. I said to her, "Kelly, Pull-Ups are diapers." She said, "I know, I know," and she started to feel really bad about it again. So before going into that, I just said, "You know what? Forget it." Before we even talked about how hard potty training has been for them and that whole thing and why didn't I do this and that, I asked her point blank, "Why didn't you do EC a long time ago when your baby was a baby? You were a stay-at-home mom. You were in Hawaii, on the beach all the time. You had my book, you had my support. Please tell me the truth. Why didn't you do it?"
Her answer, you guys, was, "I honestly didn't care." Oh, my heart sunk when I heard this, but she went on. It was just easier to just change the diaper. She had so much going on, she was a single mom. She was having a really hard time making any income. She's doing it all alone. She just wanted to sit on the beach and not think about it. "Early on," she continued, "I didn't know that he could pee in his diaper all night long, so I changed pees immediately. Then my girlfriend said, 'Don't change him all night, don't change them all day. Just let him be.'" And she did.
Kelly said that she admits that she was being lazy. She's a single mom, living in the beach life. She never wanted to be a parent. Now, how honest is that, you guys? I so appreciated her just telling me that she was never cut out for this, but she loves her child more than anything. She just was being lazy and using the diaper for the convenient tool that it was.
Fast forward to now. Now, Kelly lives with her parents and they help her, but it turns out they're lazy too, especially regarding the diapers. Back in Hawaii, Kelly said, "No one else did EC. You didn't live next door, Andrea. Everybody else told me to wait til he's ready, not to rush him."
So, you guys, even with the tools, my book, and the potty, Kelly honestly owned it. Her priorities were not the same as mine and maybe yours. She said they weren't even in place for her standards. She said she would have potty trained him way earlier, and by the time she tried when he was two, it didn't work so she backed off and she lets her son decide when and when not to wear diapers or Pull-Ups. But she didn't potty train him earlier, even though when he was 18 months I let her know he could easily be trained now and would you like my other book. She said, "No, I just wanted to go to the beach." She was totally checking out because she was an overwhelmed new mom who had a C-section and who had no support or like-minded ECers in her realm.
But upon further reflection, Kelly admits, "If you came to Maui, Andrea, and held my hand and this is how you do it, stuck around the whole time, I would have done it." That breaks my heart that I couldn't be there for her to combat the immense social pressure to wait, to make our babies carry around heavy loads of wet diapers all day long, to ignore our baby's needs and just checkout, be lazy, go to the beach, not care. Our society allows and encourages this type of parenting and ignorance is bliss. We can just check out on our smartphones instead and just scroll through Instagram all day and just look oo and ah at our babies and not have to actually engage in any kind of teaching or any kind of active lifestyle with their babies, if we so choose.
In retrospect, I know that Kelly wishes she would have done it differently and that there's nothing I can do about it, but I still feel really bad, like somehow I or the world or our culture, we've all let her down. Anyway, I've decided that there are some things I can do today despite feeling like a friend failure. I feel like Spiderman, who got to the bottom of the silo a millisecond too late and his woman perished. You remember that part? It was super sad.
I want to be a hero and I want to help everybody out, but I can't get to everybody. So here's what I'm going to ask you to do. Can you please, please, those of you listening, keep supporting other mamas, especially single moms? Clearly moms like Kelly need love and advice and support so they don't check out too. Let's be there for each other, not judgmentally. I was nonjudgmental with Kelly, for the most part, and she still chose otherwise, but I couldn't be there with her. If you're near other moms who are drowning in motherhood, please be there for them. For me, for everybody. Okay?
Here's what I'm going to do. After sharing the story with you, with my heart really heavy, all I can do is keep sharing about EC and to encourage those who don't do it, to just potty train early at 18 months. No harm, no foul, just do what you can when you can do it. But this is the best time to do it, it's easiest on you and the kids and healthiest. I'm going to keep encouraging those with older kiddos to not spread the “wait until they're ready” myth and to tell others about EC. If they're like, "Oh, I wish I would have known about that 10 years ago," well, cool. Tell people now about the option of EC, even part-time. It's easy and it allows you to be kind of lazy with parenting because then you don't have to potty train, you know?
But mostly, all evangelism aside, I'm going to keep showing up with the truth and the right info where moms and dads hang out. If it resonates, I'm going to make sure, I'm going to make darn sure, that these people like you have resources, EC coaches in their town, my book, my podcast, et cetera.
Recently, I ran into a few dads in Asheville who have had success with EC with their babies. They approached me and said, "Hey, are you Andrea Olson? My mom, my wife, I mean my wife, this baby's mom, is going to freak out when she hears that I met you." I'm really glad that they came up to me and said hello, because these guys did it. They did EC despite social pressures saying elsewise and that's the moral, right? You never know who you're going to impact for the better by sharing about EC, usually a perfect stranger, often, unfortunately not the ones you love, like my BFF.
Anyway, there you have it. By the way, if you don't have a lot of people in your town who are doing EC and you want to teach people and you tell everybody about it anyway, you might consider joining the wait list to become a coach, godiaperfree.com/coachprogram, maybe check that out if that resonates so more mamas can feel more support wherever they are. We are going to start multiple enrollments a year starting in 2020, so definitely check it out.
I don't have a reader tip for you today. What I do have is this, please just encourage those mamas who are out there who are drowning in new motherhood and show them how EC can make their new motherhood life, and their new fatherhood life if it's a dad, even easier and much more connected. It makes all aspects of parenting much easier. If you're able to be there next door to somebody, go over and show them how to hold their baby, show them how to just catch the poops, just the wake-up pees. Tell them that everything counts and matters even if they have to go to preschool or daycare or the parent has to go back to work. Show them physically how to do EC. We need more people in the world showing more people how to do this.
Remember that even if they just can't do it, just tell them they can potty train earlier. Really, just by doing what you're doing, you're setting an example for other people. Some people, like these two dad strangers I met in Asheville recently, will do it and some won't, but at least we'll get people thinking about what they're doing.
EC can make parenting so much easier. You just know your baby more. You have a deeper connection, not deeper, but deep in different ways. It just makes the child more normalized and calm and also able to get into Waldorf schools early, you guys. It frees them up for learning, no kidding, seriously.
All right. Again, like I asked in the beginning, please leave a review on iTunes so more people can learn about EC. Thank you so much for being here today. Even though I don't know you, thank you for being here. And thank you Kelly for being honest with me. I love you, girl. You're amazing. Just by sharing your truth, I hope you helped a lot of people today help more mamas.
Thanks for being here. This has been the Go Diaper Free Podcast. I'm your host, Andrea Olson, and I will see you next week. Oh, by the way, oh my gosh, before I go. Please come over to the blog and say hello. That's where I am. You can't talk to me here on the podcast, but you can talk to me there. Go to godiaperfree.com/62, and leave a comment with whatever you have to say about this story and anything to share. I answer every comment myself. I'll talk to you guys next week. Thanks so much, have a good one.
I can’t imagine how insanely hard it must be to be a single mum from the beginning. I hope your friend is totally comfortable with you sharing all those details about her situation.
I personally didn’t EC despite having all the tools. My baby had very bad silent reflux, and by two weeks of age our household was full of pain, tears and despair which lasted for months. There was no chance I would’ve been able to notice his cues. He began to make the same face and cry for every need and become generally hard to read, which is common for reflux babies. Initially I tried to persist just with timing but it just got too hard. I’m really disappointed about not being able to do it.
Amy, I feel you about not being able to do EC because of silent reflux! The fact is that there are innumerable factors that make a super-involved program like EC difficult to apply in reality. I have had to go back to work at 4 months, and even working part-time, it has been difficult for me to figure out how to approach EC when I’m not with my baby all the time and cannot realistically expect his other caregivers to commit to EC when they have more than just my son to take care of.
And I agree – I really hope Andrea’s friend is alright with having her story shared here… this post really bothered me. The tone, despite Andrea’s claim that she was being perfectly non-judgmental and is only “heartbroken” about her friend choosing the “lazy” way out…. it all comes off as supremely judgmental, with the continual emphasis on her friend being “lazy,” “checking out,” and “going to the beach” instead of focusing on teaching her baby EC.
That sounds like a very lopsided way to portray a single mother’s dedication to raising her baby and herself as a new mom, alone, far away from support systems. I’m sure that Andrea meant well, but it sounds like she got hung up on the idea of her friend “going to the beach” and, in her imagination, this became some kind of carefree “beach life” scenario where her friend was off lounging in the sun while her baby sits somewhere, unattended and miserable in dirty diapers. The reality is more likely that her friend occasionally went to the beach with her baby as a desperate way to try and find balance and get them both some fresh air, while using every bit of energy and strength she had to just keep things together, to make the rent, to buy enough food, to heal herself, to feel that she could meet each newborn milestone without scrambling… to not just crumble under the intense loneliness, isolation and pressure. To reduce that whole struggle, without knowing all the details, to “being lazy” and taking the “iPhone parent” route of non-engagement – THAT is really, outrageously judgmental.
Andrea, EC is important to you, obviously, and it’s wonderful that you care so much that you have committed to sharing your experiences with us all. But like any evangelist, if you can’t break the mindset of “this is the only correct way to do it; if you don’t do this you’re WRONG and should feel remorse for being wrong”… you’re going to ultimately only connect with people who already think like you.
It doesn’t sound like that’s what you want: you want to spread this knowledge to fellow mothers who need it, not to moms who are already doing it with relative ease and plenty of support. A great place to begin would be to step back, ask your friend in private how she truly feels, without jumping in to label her, and promise her that you’ll really listen this time, even if it hurts to hear that you weren’t a good friend in her time of need.
In the meantime, I have to agree with Ian: although I’ve been following your posts and have been interested in trying EC soon, your tone and approach here are a huge turn-off. Maybe find a coach who can help you locate your biases and tone things down to be more neutral, less judgmental, if you don’t want to lose parents who are simply working hard to keep things together and don’t have spare energy to defend themselves against accusations of laziness.
Don’t be hard on yourself Amy, you tried and it didn’t fit your family. That’s okay. I am so sorry your little one had reflux, it is so difficult to deal with. My Twyla had reflux as well, turned out it was caused by a tongue tie. xx Andrea
Thank you Andrea for an amazing podcast as always. I completely understand this single mom and her perspective. I’m in a similar situation. I had a great birt after a healthy but very stressful pregnancy. In the weeks and months after the birth I never got to properly rest or properly eat. and despite my physical recovery was kind of ok my mental and psychological one is still a work in progress. I had dark times despite the fact that I long-awaited this rainbow baby after we lost out first conceived. I longed to be a mom but because of my exhaustion I failed at the thing I cared about the most, which breastfeeding. I was heartbroken. I read the go diaper free book during pregnancy and I was so excited to start EC, but so far it’s been 5 months I couldn’t get the chance to do it, because I desperately wanted to just have some quiet time and make things as easy as possible. I needed to be lazy in order not to go crazy. When you are a tired first time mom any additional thing to do is too much. You can barely do the basics. You’re so tired you can’t read your baby, you don’t know if this whole thing was a good idea, you don’t know how you’re gonna survive and you don’t know if you’ll be able to properly care for your baby. You feel like a failure, and accomplished moms scare you, because they remind you of how much of a failure you are. I would never say to a mom that she is a failure because of course we all do our best. All moms are heroes no matter what. But in reality your baby doesn’t get the best he can just because you did your best. You would want to move mountains for your baby but your best is not enough because you are at the end of yourself.
This society fails mom’s every single time. No one helps you find and empower your motherly instincts. A natural pregnancy, birth and postpartum and natural care of a baby are something out of normality. And any idea different than normality that you have, you have to fight for it and justify yourself with everyone. Everyone doubts you and questions you and tells you what to do. It’s hard to fight for your ideas when you’re tired and overwhelmed and trying to find your new identity. EC is particularly tricky if done on our own. You have to make people study in order to help you. You have to convince them that it is a good idea. And maybe they already think you’re a hippie because you want to co-sleep or hold the baby when he cries. Even in a supportive family you always have to remind them that you are the mother and that they have to take you seriously. It’s a lot of work and not all moms have enough energy to do it. So you just throw in the towel and think you’re going to be fine in the end, because everyone potty trains at one point and kids end up just fine.
I honestly think I’m too weak to be an accomplished mom, because I can barely take care of my health or have a proper nutrition while caring for my baby. But I believe that if I had baby experience previous to my pregnancy, if I saw young mothers do their thing when I myself was younger, if I were part of a community of mothers, things wouldn’t be so hard.
Thank you for sharing your story Marianna. I am so sorry you are struggling, it sounds like you may have PPD. I hope you are seeking help. I agree completely, mothers are sent home with a brand new little human and no support. Even friends and family often don’t give the support that is needed. I will say that first and foremost you need to take care of yourself as a mother. Even if you can’t do everything you hoped with your baby, a healthy mom is the best gift in the world. Don’t be afraid to ask for help, tell those around you exactly what you need. xx Andrea
I am a worse version of your friend Kelly 🤦♀️
The biggest thing holding me from EC is pure laziness, my son is 18 months already. I listen to all your podcast & I know it works because I did try for a little bit, but then stopped bcuz of laziness & no support from society as well. Just want wish you all the best ❤️
That’s okay Arian! He’s the perfect age to potty train. Don’t be afraid to dive right in. I actually recommend just doing it, don’t bother telling family and friends. You’ll just get a lot of unsolicited advice and naysayers. You’ve got this! xx Andrea
I’m a new mom and EC saved my sanity! Maybe its a mindset thing. At the end of the day its priority… what are you willing to give up to get get what you want? My husband is away every three weeks so I solo it. I learned a long time ago that every life event is a choice and how you feel about is your choice. Take responsibility. for it. You will never be a victim again because if you created it… you can CHANGE it. The thought of changing a daiper instead of just flushing it away grosses me out. I love seeing how my baby sing and enjoys sitting on the top hat potty, sometimes even when I miss read her signs and she doesnt go… she sits there happy.
❤
I am so glad to hear EC has been a wonderful experience for you Jenny! Sometimes it really does make a difference to feel like you have control over something simple, like where your baby goes potty. xx Andrea
Just wanted to take a minute to send some love after a few negative-vibe comments. It seems clear to me that you and your BFF were on the same page about you sharing this info, and obviously you know your friend and her situation and how to communicate with/relate to her better than any reader/listener here. I totally get your heaviness of heart here because I feel this way with a lot of our lifestyle choices (natural home birth, EC, vegan, etc.). I don’t judge those who don’t subscribe to similar practices, but when I have a close friend/family member who clearly expresses interest and agreement with a certain practice or mindset, but then has issues with the follow through due to lack of support, it’s hard to see. (Remember guys, Andrea said *years* before this is a practice her BFF saw firsthand and *wanted* Andrea to support her in and help her practice! This is why Andrea constantly checked in and offered any assistance via phone while her new mom BFF was living far away!)
I hated seeing those negative comments. I get where those listeners were coming from, but I think they just misread and misunderstood your approach and presentation of the situation. It sucks to be berated for being misunderstood. I love your work and honestly could not have made it in EC without your book and podcasts! Keep up the great work! <3
Thank you for your kind words Sarah. Absolutely, I’m not judging at all. I just felt so terrible that my friend felt she didn’t have the support to do something she had wanted to do. Mothers need more support, that’s the takeaway! xx Andrea
You sound so rude. I highly doubt she was checked out taking care of a baby by herself. Just because you have all the support and all the Time in the world to do whatever you choose to do with your baby doesn’t mean that she had to do that.
Hi Kay, The point of this wasn’t to sound rude or judgmental. I know she didn’t have the support to do EC, and I feel terrible about that. The takeaway from this should be what I said at the end, “If you’re near other moms who are drowning in motherhood, please be there for them.”. xx Andrea
A handful of people react with inspiration when they see me EC my baby. MOST people say “there are too many things going on as a mom, I just wouldn’t be able to handle another thing to be on top of”. it IS easier to use diapers, without a question. I wouldn’t call it lazy, just busy, perhaps overwhelmed, and like you said, different priorities. EC is very important to me, but even to me not as important as my own peace of mind, say, or my children’s healthy food intake. It can’t come at the expense of anything. If its working in harmony with all of those other things then great. But honesty with yourself is crucial. Thanks for sharing this story.
Wow…. I am honestly shocked at such a judgmental podcast from you. I read your book 6 years ago, did part time EC with two of my three kids, and have been following you on and off ever since. Andrea, you are an amazing woman with all that you‘ve accomplished!
But, I think sometimes when you get very deep into something it is easy to lose perspective. As much as I love EC, please remember that it‘s only ONE of the many things that a loving, dedicated parent can do to connect with thier child.
I did EC with the first two kids, but was too lazy (or overwhelmed….) to do it with the third. At the time I felt really bad, but now that‘s all behind us, and you know what? it‘s OK.
Hi! I am sorry this sounded judgmental to you. I fully realize EC isn’t for everyone. I just felt bad that my friend wanted to practice EC, had planned on it, but ultimately wasn’t able to because she was drowning in motherhood. I wish she had had the support she needed to feel like anything was possible. xx Andrea
You’re right Nechama, everyone has different priorities. Every family has to find what works best for them. I do think when mothers have more support they feel more capable of doing the things they want to do, instead of being in survival mode. xx Andrea
Okay. Let’s all keep a little perspective. I never heard Andrea say that parents who don’t do EC are lazy…I heard her say that her friend said it about herself. Some people do check out. Some people don’t do EC because they are lazy. Andrea is passionate about caring for babies and their needs. Andrea runs a couple businesses and cares for her family while helping others, so let’s give her a bit of a break. I wouldn’t say she has more time than anyone else! Andrea has encouraged me to simplify my life so that I can do what I want to care for my baby and work toward starting a business. Andrea has changed my life for the better.
Thank you for your kind words Mandy! xx Andrea
It seems like many people are missing the moral of the story. Support those who feel overwhelmed, especially single parents! Oh well. Thanks again Andrea!
…My last comment sounded a bit condescending…not my intent. I do think people misunderstood what I think Andrea was saying. I gathered that she really believed in her friend’s ability to do EC. She encouraged us to support those who might be feeling overwhelmed. Laziness is often a symptom of feeling overwhelmed, unmotivated, defeated. Sometimes we make choices not to do important things because we don’t think we can. I think anyone can choose to do EC if they decide to. EC looks different in your house than mine. You might just catch a couple or maybe you catch them all! I think Andrea believed in her friend. Let’s support each other where we are at, but let’s not stay there. Let’s all continue to grow and do our best with EC and life in general! Love&Thanks
I agree Mandy, the point of the story was missed by most people. I wasn’t judging my friend, just trying to figure out why she hadn’t done something she had planned on and wanted to do. Finding out it was a lack of support broke my heart, that I couldn’t be there for her. The message I wanted to send was for people to support the mothers they know, be there, help. Give them the confidence to do the things they want to do so they don’t feel like they’re drowning. xx Andrea
…My last comment sounded a bit condescending…not my intent. I think people misunderstood what I think Andrea was trying to say. I gathered that she really believed in her friend’s ability to do EC. She encouraged us to support those who might be feeling overwhelmed. Laziness is often a symptom of feeling defeated or overwhelmed. Sometimes we don’t do important things because we feel like we can’t. I think anyone can do EC, in one form or another, maybe it’s just catching a few or maybe catching them all! If someone can change a diaper, then they can potty their baby. Let’s support those who feel overwhelmed. Let’s all encourage each other to do the best with what we have and where we are at in the process; not just with EC. Let’s give her friend a little credit, just like Andrea did.